Sub-skills!

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Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Mon Jun 01, 2009 4:51 am

I really liked this idea (on the forums)! It's similar to my hobbies idea, and similar to another idea that myself and Pokesaber have dabbled with... but it's quite a nice concept, even if most of them would make great skills in their own right (or, in some cases, would be better as additions).

Xenarcha wrote:
Spoiler:
Hey. I'm xenarcha, and this is my big idea. I hope you like it.

Sub Skills: the next big step in Runescape Skills

Runescape has a total of 21 skills, ranging from the basic Attack skill to the newest skill; Summoning. There is a huge debate for the ‘next’ skill, but perhaps it is time to expand our existing skills, instead of bringing in new ones. Thus the idea of ‘Sub Skills’ born.

-The Reasons for Sub Skills-

The purpose of the Sub Skills is to provide new interests, diversities and useful assets in the higher levels of every existing Skill on Runescape (what would become known as the ‘Base Skill; Attack etc).
The Sub Skill would also attend to some of the many-wanted updates (and in some cases, problems) to the existing Skills in Runescape, from new combat animations, to finding something useful in farming, creating your own summoning charms, exploring long lost tunnel systems, becoming the ultimate thief, getting to grips with some new high class weaponry, searching the bottom of the ocean, and much, much more!

-So how does it work?-

For every Base Skill, there would be a corresponding Sub Skill, which would be unlocked once the Base Skill level is raised to 55. This will make the Sub Skills far more valuable to acquire.
The Sub Skills themselves would work in the same way as the base skills, but on a smaller level. Each Sub Skill would be from level 1 to 99, and would have different abilities etc. unlocked at different levels of training, exactly like the Base Skills.
In addition to this, some sub skills have their own ‘Special Menu’ that allows boosts, much like prayer, for a short time. This doesn’t, however, drain current level (like prayers), but can only be used at certain times, which will change with increased levels.
Sub Skills, until unlocked by reaching level 55 in their corresponding base skill, remain inactive of any effects they would normally have at level 1, and are preset to level ‘0’.

-The Sub Skill Acquisition Mini-quest-

When the base skill hits level 55, a player will be automatically awarded an item called ‘Mysterious Bracelet‘, which will automatically equip to a player’s glove slot. If the slot is already full, the Bracelet will be put in the players inventory. If the player’s inventory is full, the bracelet will be put in their bank.
The bracelet, when equipped, can be ‘operated‘ and will ‘pull‘, much like a Runecrafting talisman, to a certain direction (locations are different for each Sub Skill). The player must manually find the location the Bracelet pulls to. When the player finds the location (different for each Sub Skill), a cutscene will happen (Also different), followed by a test (testing your ingenuity of your Base Skill) activated by rubbing the bracelet.
When the player passes the test, the location will open the doorway to the Master, who will inform the player about the Sub Skill they have unlocked, and the Bracelet will be renamed ’[Sub Skill Name] Bracelet’. These Sub Skill Masters will give the player 83 Xp in that Sub Skill so they can start training the Sub Skill. Some of them sell equipment and supplies etc. for the players who have proved themselves worthy to come into their presence.

-Bracelet-

All the bracelets are simple bands of coloured leather, with a coloured piece of string attached to them. Attached to these strings is an object representing the bracelet’s skill (e.g. the Evasion bracelet has an agility man on the string). In addition, each bracelet has a unique decoration above the string.

-Why not just add these as updates to existing Skills, or simply make them their own skills?-

If these Sub Skills were added as their own individual skills, they would clutter up the skill lists, and seeing as they’d reflect certain aspects of existing skills, it would almost be splitting a whole skill into pieces, which would be pointless.
If the Sub Skills were added just as an ‘update’ to existing skills, they would have to be spread out on a whole range of different levels, meaning that many players would already have the ability to do the highest level things. If a person with level 99 Attack suddenly had a whole new range of things added to the Attack skill, he’d have to do no work at all to use them. This would undermine the value of these additions.
This is why the Sub Skills need to remain separate, but also attached, to their Base Skills. Hence the ‘unlocking’ of the Sub Skills at level 55 of the Base Skill would mean even a level 99 Attacker would still have to train the Attack Sub Skill from level 1, meaning everyone would have a fair start at training.

-Hiscores-

Obviously the Sub Skills would need a Hiscore table. I think it would be best if a list of Sub Skills is added next to the Base Skills, each corresponding to their Subs and Bases (e.g. The Attack Sub Skill would next to the Attack Base Skill). This would rank for the top 2 million in the Sub Skills, just like the Base Skills.
When reading an individual player’s skills, there would be 2 tabs under their name, just above the Skill lists. These tabs would be labelled ‘Base Skills’ and ‘Sub Skills’. Clicking on either one would bring up the corresponding Skill list. This would save page space and be easy to use.

-Knowledge Base-

Note: The Sub Skills would be in the ‘Manual’ section of the Game Guide

The ‘Skills’ link would be recoded to direct to another page with 2 links, 1 labelled ‘Base Skills’, which would take you to the normal lists that exist now, and the other labelled ‘Sub Skills’ which would take you to a list of each individual Sub Skill. They would be categorised not by name, but by what Base Skill they correspond to, which would be labelled alphabetically. The Sub Skill names would be alongside their icons, with a short description of themselves, similar to the Base Skill list layout.
In addition to this, there would be a link at the top of this list called ‘Sub Skill Summary’, which summarise the basics of the Sub Skills, and gives a brief History about them .
Each Sub Skill guide would be in the same layout as the Base Skill layout, with links to ‘The basics’, the different information, and then the Extra features and the FAQ’s. Using this system similar to the base skills would provide a template for building the lists, and would be easy for players to navigate.

-Sub Skill List-

These are the lists of the sub skills; below the list is an extensive description of each sub skill.

-Base Skill: Sub Skill-

Agility: Evasion
Attack: Battle Mastery
Construction: Engineering
Cooking: Cuisine
Crafting: Sheath Craft
Defence: Shieldlore
Farming: Rootlore
Firemaking: Flare Weaver
Fishing: Mariner
Fletching: Bladelore
Herblore: Concoctor
Hit Points: Stamina
Hunter: Beast Taming
Magic: Warlock
Mining: Excavation
Prayer: Shaman
Range: Marksman
Runecrafting: Augmenter
Slayer: Harbinger
Smithing: Forge Mastery
Strength: Brawler
Summoning: Invoker
Thieving: Stealth Craft
Woodcutting: Forestry


Last edited by 3mptylord on Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:56 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Mon Jun 01, 2009 4:52 am

Xenarcha wrote:
Spoiler:
Short Summary of each sub skill:

Short Summary of each sub skill:

The sub skills go in with the new hp system and the new combat system, where damage and hp are scaled up so you absolutely cannot 1-hit-kill another player in PvP. All the enemies and monsters in Runescape will also learn a few of the more combat-driven sub skills, so don’t expect a cakewalk with Jad either!

Evasion: Time to learn how to avoid your opponents attacks, adding more diversity into combat. Land surprise hits, daze your opponents, even pick up a little gold whilst you’re fighting!

Battle Mastery: Get your fight on! With this sub skill, you’ll learn how to master your chosen weapons, landing new and vicious weapon-based attacks, learn how to parry your opponents attacks, damage your opponents armour and weapons, and even land critical hits.

Engineering: This skill is twofold. First, it's time to build some heavy-duty wrecking weapons, mobile and stationary, perfect for PvP battles and scoring heavy multi-target damage! Second; it’s nifty for creating little gadgets that’ll help you in every skill, from clockwork additions to your tools, to small carts for your mount to carry, all the way up to your very own customised gnome glider!

Cuisine: Tired of all your food being tasteless and just something to regain that hp? Time to spice it up a bit with cuisine, from learning how to add that little something extra for a better taste, to cooking your chosen food in different ways to alter its’ effects when eaten, all the way to making your own full meals that can completely restore your hp!

Sheath Craft: This handy skill will help when you want to carry all those runes, bows and swords without cluttering your inventory. Make belts, buckles, bandoleers, sheaths, quivers, pouches and satchels out of loads of different materials. You could even make some handy saddlebags for your new mount…

Shieldlore: Time to really get to grips with your handy left hand! Learning a new range of more effective blocks counterblows and even disarming your opponent. Did I mention you’ll also learn how to duel wield your favourite weapons?

Rootlore: For all of you with green fingers, it’s about time you got something interesting to do whilst waiting for your crops to grow. Time to venture into the maw of the earth, and uncovering a mass of new things to grow, harvest and discover, from the roots of your favourite trees, to long-lost bounties of nature that will sell high or give you an edge over the other farmers.

Flare Weaver: For all the pyromaniacs out there, it’s time to actually use your fires for something other than just staring at! Learn how to control your fires with your mind, creating small sparks and the odd fireball at first, but eventually working your way up to manipulating lava and searing the earth with your very presence! No more need for those inventory cluttering tinderboxes either!

Mariner: Get your diving gear ready, we’re going down! Mariner will let you explore the ocean depths, finding new fish to hunt, seafood to gather, and the odd tussle with a giant octopus or a killer whale! You might even find some forgotten underwater caverns to explore, and who knows? Maybe even a new city…

Bladelore: Tired of adding feathers to arrows? No more! It’s time to make some mean weapons. Some nasty weapons. Weapons that will make your opponents cower in fear! Maybe you’ll start out with the few odd throwing needles, but soon enough you’ll be making razor discs, blade-staves, hook-strings and glaives. Your opponent won't know what hit them with these bad boys…

Concoctor: Time for the meaner side of herblore. You’ll start out making a few nasty little ointments to spread on a dagger, stat-lowering poisons and other nasty little serums, but soon you’ll be liquefying your opponents with acid-pots and napalm-bottles, blinding them with smoke bombs, and who knows? Maybe even the odd explosive or two. There’ll also be the lighter side with more stat boosters and a few special doses that could make you immune to certain elements for a while…

Stamina: First off, this skill goes in with the new HP rework, where you gain 10 hitpoints per level instead of 1, and a maximum of 1000 hitpoints (wearing the hp cape boost) at level 99. With stamina; you’ll regain your hp quicker, be able to carry things as if they were lighter, and your food will be just that little bit more effective.

Beast Taming: Time for another huge step in Runescape history; the introduction of mounts! You’ll start small with a donkey or a similar beast of burden, which can help carry a few items and will not disappear like your summoning familiars, unless you don’t look after your friendly animal and it runs away of it’s own accord. Soon enough you’ll be riding your mount on a newly crafted saddle, carrying your weapons and supplies, and learning how to improve your fighting in the saddle! You’ll also be able to craft armour, saddlebags, sheaths, weapons to fight with whilst on your mount, and mobile heavy weaponry for your mount using other sub skills. And you don’t have to go it alone either! With the larger mounts, you can have a few friends ride with you! You’ll be the victors of the clan war if you and your fellow clan mates take the first charge on battle-tiger back, and then the big guns come up from behind on the war elephants…

Warlock: The long awaited sub skill that makes your magic worthwhile. With the warlock sub skill, you’ll learn how to augment items with mana to enhance your magical power, increase the effectiveness of your spells, team up with other mages and pool your power to cast devastating multi-spells, create magic circles and use new arcane knowledge to bring forth deadly monsters to fight at your side, hone your skill so that you need fewer runes to cast spells, unlock a vast store of new and annihilating spells, and most importantly of all; tip the balance of power so that magic is once more a deadly form of combat.

Excavation: Mining a rock can become tiresome after a while. Time to plunge into the depths of the earth in tunnels you create, shoring up the shafts with beams and monitoring your progress as you descend into the core of the world. Mine new ores and discover a vast range of new gems and other valuable items from beneath the earth. Explore long-forgotten temples and catacombs, underground reservoirs of magic water, new and ferocious deep-dwelling horrors to fight, and discover ancient relics and armours that even the most battle-hardened veteran will be jealous you possess. But take care, because you might get lost if you don’* watch where you’re heading…

Shaman: For those who think prayer has been a bit too goody-goody, it’s time to get your voodoo on. You’ll start small with a few little incantations to the heathen gods; old deities long forgotten from the reach of Saradomin, and build your way up to the most dangerous of ritual knowledge as you take on the mantle of the necromancer. Command the Undead and bring forth age-old spectres to aid you in combat or other means. Maybe you’ll even learn how to bring forth the souls of age old warriors to help you in your fights…

Marksman: For the keen-eyed ranger, this sub skill is a must. Time to sight along your bow for a bulls-eye shot, learn how to handle the new range of weapons available from Bladelore, and eventually you’ll be shooting around corners and over obstacles you once had to move around to take aim. Eventually you’ll be landing every shot at your opponents weak spots in their armour, and no one will be able to stop your onslaught.

Augmenter: Time to make those runes more effective. With Augmenter, you can empower your runes so they last longer, and make your spells more powerful, whether they’re combat driven or not. You’ll learn how to make new runes for new spells, and eventually you’ll be commanding the power of gods with your arcane skills…

Harbinger: There are some monsters in this world that cannot be merely taken down by a special tool or weapon. You need to know how to strike, and where to strike, to be the most effective. Harbinger will allow you to learn about your enemies as you kill them, their weak spots, their false moves. You’ll soon be dispatching monsters you once thought were tough with greater ease as you sever the nerve here and there that makes their attacks so vicious. A horde of new monsters released in conjunction with the other sub skills will also test your worth in this sub skill, as not all monsters are so easy to kill. Watch your back and guard your blade, because this skill will also let you more effectively attack your opponents in PvP, where brute force might not necessarily prevail.

Forge Mastery: Bringing new life to smithing, this skill will let you repair your armour and weapons where they were damaged in combat, enhance your weapons with sharper edges and custom hilts, create armour for your mounts and stabilised plates for your siege weapons, and best of all, allow you to customise your own armour with spikes, padding, chain mail pieces, shoulder pads, built-in blades, and hundreds of other items. The best add-on pieces may have to be bought or uncovered from other sub skills, as the fabled dragon-crest isn’t something you can just make out of ore. And the truly ancient armour pieces uncovered from ill-gotten means in temples far below ground, may be broken forever unless the most skilled of forge masters can rebuild them…

Brawler: With bloodied fists we charge screaming at our enemies with brawler, fighting with our bare fists with energy we did*’t know we commanded. Crumple your enemies armour with a berserk combo attack, crush their helms with your bare hands, and kick them across the battlefield as your blood rages! This is one primal sub skill you won’t soon forget!

Invoker: A powerful tool for the summoner, this will allow you to better command your familiars, allowing you to command them to attack an enemy, or protect you from harm with their own health. As well as this, it will allow you to track and discover rifts in the world that leads to the spirit world, which you can enter to discover new powers and items which will aid you in many aspects of your activities. You will also be able to open more permanent portals at the summoning obelisks, allowing you to travel to the spirit world and retrieve spirit shards from the spirit obelisks (like the rune essence stacks), and also allow you to learn how to craft your own charms from ceramic. If you’re very lucky, you might also gain the ability to summon some very dangerous spirit creatures, if you can find and defeat them…

Stealth craft: Even the most cunning of thieves gets caught from time to time. With the stealth craft sub skill, you’ll learn how to blend in with the background so to speak, as well as some other darker activities. You’ll learn how to assassinate your enemies, steal the most priceless of possessions from NPC characters, build traps for your enemies that will come in especially handy for PvP, and best of all, if you manage to survive in PvP for long enough, you may get the chance to pickpocket an enemy player and steal some gold directly from their bank account!

Forestry: You think you know trees? Think again, with this sub skill you’ll learn how to harvest more than just logs, from sap and bark cuttings to grubs and other wonders that will sell for a high price, or enhance your own gain in sub skills. You’ll learn about the rarity of trees, and which ones will yield the most logs, which ones have had birds’ nests in them, and how to extract more than just plain logs from the branches of the tree. You’ll also find a new range of trees just waiting for the high level woodcutters to sink their axes into…

Well, that's all of the sub skill summaries. I hope you enjoyed reading them. The point is that sub skills will enhance the skills already in place in Runescape, as well as adding a vast amount of new content for all types of players, be they skillers or Pkers or Questers, as these new sub skills and the new locations they unlock could also allow new quests to be written with a huge amount of requirements. Grandmaster quests anyone?

I can honestly say I didn't read the first bit, I skim read it and went onto the skills. But most are pretty sound... although, well... Tongue


Last edited by 3mptylord on Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:56 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by TATORZ on Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:51 am

OMG so much to read...
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Mon Jun 01, 2009 6:55 pm

I know lol... just, urmm, read the second post! Smile


Ooh... didn't realise you could insert Line Breaks. Well, I remember being able to, but I couldn't find it. I should really read the tips more often lol.

Tip: Tips appear between the format buttons and the text box. Just underneath the BIUS... you know? Tongue

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If all good things come to an end then we're living in a world where evil wins. 

If there once was love then maybe something survived. If we find a single diamond in the rough then it's worth it. Through a thousand tears if there's one drop of love then it's worth it. 
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by TATORZ on Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:01 am

Ummm... yes? Tongue
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by Dark Avorian on Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:26 am

One word! YESSSSSS!

After reflection I have a few notes...

Melee: Be careful, strength and attack subskills already are powerful (should probably be separate, attack working with weapons, str w/o. and my major conccern is the fact that defence is being treated as a melee skill

Shaman: Healing Spells, Holy Barriers, more...

Beast Taming: I like the idea but mounts aren't suggestible
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:52 pm

I comment on mounts, Xenarcha said that they are purely combat-oriented and not designed to be quicker modes of transport. If you get me. Most of Jagex's dislike for mounts is that the game is too small to need a horse to get you from A to B, I'm not sure where they stand on a combat-orientated idea. Tongue

I did say that these would have to be balanced with familiars, if they are too good it makes Summoning useless, and if they are worse then there's no point in the first place. Grin

As for combat subskills, I think "Professions" would go better there.

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If all good things come to an end then we're living in a world where evil wins. 

If there once was love then maybe something survived. If we find a single diamond in the rough then it's worth it. Through a thousand tears if there's one drop of love then it's worth it. 
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by Dark Avorian on Wed Jun 03, 2009 9:27 am

Aaah...withdrawn...

And I really, really, really don't like the professions Idea.
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:47 pm

I fail to see how, in effect, sub-skills and professions are so greatly different.

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If all good things come to an end then we're living in a world where evil wins. 

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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by Dark Avorian on Wed Jun 03, 2009 8:56 pm

Because if I train a sub-skill the only "permanent damage" to my account is that the sub-skill is higher. If I train a profession I'm limiting one of the other professions.

I would like it if professions were switchable but you had to go into some deep dungeon in order to do it that isn't in the wildy or accessible in PvP worlds. That way your stuck with the profession until you want to switch. but you still can switch.
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:12 pm

... but you can switch just by asking the Tutor to reset your points (costs, of course).

Tutors could claim it's too dangerous to reset your points in PVP Worlds, and Bounty Worlds can't access Lumbridge anyway.

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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:28 pm

To add some realism to skills (such as, knowing how to make a ring does not increase your knowledge in working with leather), and to add some variety, sub-skills would replace the existing skill system. Each "Skill", such as Crafting, is just the generic name for a compilation of related "Sub-skills" - each sub-skill is, effectively, a skill in it's own right (in that it has its own level and experience count). Sub-skills would have individual caps (ie, not all sub-skills would require 99 levels of content). A skill's level is based off the total experience of the contained skills (possibly an average). The Cape of Accomplishment is obtained when you have mastered a Skill (as opposed to one aspect of it, as most players would probably admit to).

Veterans would receive a boost so that all current sub-sections match their current level (even though disciplines such as Weaving may have never been trained by the average player). However, new sub-sections would start at level 1, meaning even existing players have something to do - including cape wearers, as their cape is unwearable in the time when they haven't mastered all aspect of their skill. Future updates could include further expansions to the skill, and capes would function like the Quest Cape of Accomplishment. Mining's sub-section "Archaeology" could be released with Kudos Isle, rather than with the bulk should this idea be excepted. Smile


Mining
• Archaeology
• Excavation
• Mining
• Panning
• Prospecting

Smithing
• Metalwork
• Smelting
• Smithing

Agility
• Endurance
• Physique
• Stamina

Thieving
• Lockpicking
• Pickpocketing

Mysticism
• Binding
• Cursing
• [healing]
• Prayer


Woodcutting
• Carving
• Felling
• Forestry
• Logging

Firemaking

Herblore
Sorcery
• Alchemy
• Augmentation
• Enchantment
• Lunar Magics
• Psionics

Slayer

Fishing
• Caging
• Harpooning
• Luring
• Netting

Cooking

Construction
Summoning
• Demonology
• Spiritualism

Rearing
• Domestication
• Husbandry
• Taming

Crafting
• Glassblowing
• Jewelling
• Leatherworking
• Potting
• Spinning
• Tailoring
• Weaving
• Woodcraft

Fletching

Survival
• [den building]
• Hunter
• Tracking
• Trapping


Zoanthropy


Conjuring

Runecraft

Farming

Necromancy


Combat skills would not be split as with other skills. Instead, combat skills would be given "professions", which function similar to talent trees in other games.


Attack and Strength;
• Swordsman
• Berserker (or Barbarian?)
• Guard

Magic and Mana;
• Archmage
• Elemental/Arcanist
• Warlock


Ranged and Marksmanship;
• Arbalest
• Hunter
• Marksman


Last edited by 3mptylord on Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:22 am; edited 5 times in total

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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Thu Jun 04, 2009 5:42 am

Is anyone here good at Paint-style Art? I need the Necromancy and Zoanthropy logos RuneScape-ised. Tongue

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If all good things come to an end then we're living in a world where evil wins. 

If there once was love then maybe something survived. If we find a single diamond in the rough then it's worth it. Through a thousand tears if there's one drop of love then it's worth it. 
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Oh...

Post by Dark Avorian on Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:16 am

Oh lol... never realized that you could simply reset them...completely ignore me
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Re: Sub-skills!

Post by 3mptylord on Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:19 am

You have input, lol Tongue

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If all good things come to an end then we're living in a world where evil wins. 

If there once was love then maybe something survived. If we find a single diamond in the rough then it's worth it. Through a thousand tears if there's one drop of love then it's worth it. 
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3mptylord
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