Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

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Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:32 am

First topic message reminder :

Felt the need to change the title, as the conversation has moved on from just ROTM...


Last edited by Slayer Noir on Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:08 am; edited 2 times in total
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Mon Sep 19, 2011 6:21 am

Just pooped my pants...

You: I've defeated Lucien
Wise Old Man: Truly, your bravery exceeds your stature, but I fear his defeat will not be permanent"


LUCIEN'S COMING BACK!


So yeah, we're all screwed.

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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Handeath on Mon Sep 19, 2011 6:59 am

I doubt it. Mahjarrat can be killed, and if anyone can do it, the Dragonkin can.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Mon Sep 19, 2011 7:14 am

Why would Jagex have the Wise Old Man say it then?
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Handeath on Mon Sep 19, 2011 10:51 am

I could be wrong, but I'm rather sure of myself.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Duskcurse on Mon Sep 19, 2011 11:31 am

Hey did you speaked with Kuradal, she wanted so much revenge on Lucien, and you say she was crying over lucien's body, she could be crying out of anger for all whe know, she could be anger that it wasn't her who killed him
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:58 pm

It might be anger, sadness or tears of joy. To see the monster finally dead is probably enough to imprint on anyone.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Duskcurse on Thu Sep 22, 2011 11:46 am

Hey SLayer could you post here Dathana's message?
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Sun Sep 25, 2011 2:21 am

I was going to use Sliske in a quest, an NPC quest, which features Terra Maelstrom when he was fairly young and having to live in Draynor during the Pure Blood riots in Arzonus (during which, humans were cast out by extremists, whilst they were originally allowed at the beginning of the 5th age).

During the quest, Sliske is discovered beneath Draynor Village, within a dungeon hidden within the sewers. Here, he is breeding "true" basilisks and plans to strike Draynor with needless savagery, using the basilisks. It should be noted that the basilisks are not those found in the Slayer dungeon (those are but poor imitations, the product of evolution), but enormously large and deadly snakes, as they are best recognised.

He is breeding them and Terra fights one of the children of the mother basilisk (not seen). Sliske escapes into the shadows after the fight and is able to command the basilisk by vocal command.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Sun Sep 25, 2011 4:11 am

I really like your idea. Whilst I'm angry at Sliske for his actions in ROTM, he intrigues me and another quest about him would be very nice. However, consider the following:

1. ROTM was Sliske's big debut. If it were possible for players to see Sliske here before they saw him in ROTM, it would undermine that debut. To avoid it, you'd have to have ROTM as a requirement for your NPQ. Would you be OK with that or would you rather keep your quest accessible?

2. Sliske is WEIRD. It's hard enough to understand his motivations, let alone write about them. And he does things differently to other Mahjarrat, preferring to use and manipulate others where possible. What's Sliske's motivation here? Why Draynor? Why just mindless slaughter? I don't get what he would gain from attacking Draynor with basilisks, unless it's a trap to make Terra a barrow wight.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Sun Sep 25, 2011 4:57 am

Terra was born with the ability to see the future and enter the dreamscape. Imagine how useful that would be for a Mahjarrat to have those.

Foresight to see who will die at the ritual. Mahjarrat are suggested to have the ability to traverse the Dreamscape (Zemouregal has done this to both Arrav and the player).

ROTM is Sliske's debut, but not a suiting signature quest. Every Mahjarrat has had a quest focussed entirely around them, save for Sliske. He needs this quest, but why should ROTM be compulsory? It's only a short quest just for kicks. Besides, Sliske taming the Basilisk is very different to Sliske being responsible for the Barrows. Let's save that for the Ritual and give Sliske a little love.

Sliske is breeding Basilisks so he can use them for the upcoming ritual, that is, until Terra paints the future. Draynor is a "neutral" zone. It sits between Mithalin and Asgarnia and both sides don't really lay claim to it. It is an easy target. The attack on Draynor would make world news. Imagine the look on your Mahjarrat brethren's faces when they heard that Sliske was back and he's got some nasty reptiles on his side. It kind of knocks the undead down a notch.

Undead? Reeking of death, decaying and just returning from the dead, big deal! Basilisks? The mere glance into their eyes can kill, their poison is amongst the deadliest in the world and they are far more aggressive, with few being privy to the powers to control them.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Sun Sep 25, 2011 6:47 am

Obviosly, having ROTM as a requirement is your choice, since it's your quest, but your explanation doesn't really shift my opinion - having done ROTM I feel the moment when Sliske turns up would be a lot less exciting if I've already seen and fought him. Besides which, Sliske is not really considered an enemy until the events of ROTM - before that we expect him to fight on our side, so knowing he's a bad person from your quest would ruin the surprise when you find it out in ROTM.

So we have a motive for Sliske wanting control of Terra, good, but the motivation for attacking Draynor is a bit off in my opinion. Sliske is infamously shadowy and slippery. He's not the kind of Mahjarrat who wants his brothers to notice him - he likes to keep quiet and be a puppet master in the background. Attention seeking isn't his style if you ask me.

Other than that, you have the makings of a really really cool plot, but since you're centering it around Sliske, it could fall flat if you get Sliske's character wrong.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Sun Sep 25, 2011 6:49 am

Of course, Sliske isn't a true enemy. He may have an aggressive response to Terra, but the player hasn't properly met him, so his allegiances lie all over.

Who would suspect Draynor was harbouring one of the deadliest species in Gielinor? No one would. If anyone did mention anything, they wouldn't know the first thing of what to do.

Draynor was just something of an easy target. Small population, on the borders, poor defences. Barbarians could have easily done it. Sliske has an obvious favour to destroying the weak, it's a natural philosophy to his kind and how he keeps the basilisks so powerful. Besides, baby basilisks are a hungry bunch and humans are just what they need to survive.

"Etched in the blood of the basilisk, I sketched a future I did not understand with the fang of the foul beast, but the foul sorceror for which I fought was able to read the runes. Despite lacking any distinctive odour and any lips, this faceless man was clearly enthralled with joy, but now I know of it to be more schadenfreude. I saw ten shapes, two smudged, but the mark of the snake was in tact.

For some reason, the orb of Raizahka was there. Was she there too?"
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Sun Sep 25, 2011 7:47 am

If I'm totally honest I think we're going round in circles. My explanations fail to change your opinion and yours fail to change mine.

I personally think the plot you've set up would be better suited to Zemourgal - he's always been big on conquest, having attacked Varrock a few times. Sliske likes to collect people, not cities, and he likes to do it with subtlety.

You think Sliske's character suits the actions in your quest, I don't. But it's your quest, so do it your way.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Sun Sep 25, 2011 9:09 pm

From what you've seen, how does Sliske behave?
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Mon Sep 26, 2011 8:10 am

Sliske is a puppeteer. He's subtle, quiet, if you will. He doesn't need, nor does he seem to enjoy attention. He manipulates individuals to do his dirty work for him. And he's patient: he waited a while to get the barrows brothers and it seems he's been observing you for some time before he attempts to attack you. Sliske is willing to wait for an opportunity to come along so he doesn't have to make an opportunity. Sliske is sly, not brutish.

For this plot, I think you need another antagonist. Sliske wouldn't bother to breed basilisk himself, not when he could trick someone into making them for him. He'd use subtle things: he wouldn't go "HEY YOU, MAKE ME SOME BASILISK", but he'd always be in the background, perhaps as a librarian who recommends a book on basilisk or a passer by who somehow inspires the antagonist to set up in Draynor. Little things that steer the plot towards a desirable outcome.

I think Sliske would orchestrate the entire plot of your quest (both the protagonist and the antagonist's actions) to gain a desirable outcome: I think he would most desire possession of Terra and perhaps the new antagonist - it's clear a Mahjarrat of his power could've conquered land or gained a large human following, since several weaker Mahjarrat have done so, but he seems to just enjoy collecting unique individuals.

I actually think he enjoys making other people do things he could do himself. I believe Sliske could've resurrected Nex himself, for example, but I think he gained some sick pleasure from making others do it for him. Same here - he could breed an army of basilisk and beat Terra in a one on one fight himself, but he'd enjoy it more if he made someone else do it.

Sliske's command over the situation could, however, be undone by Terra's foresight.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:34 pm

Ruantan...

In exchange for food, Ruantan is impregnanted with basilisk venom so it could be a surrogate father.

He anticipates the coming of a warrior to fell a Basilisk, so will wait until they come. They die, he destroys them. They survive, he'll claim them. Terra has potential to become a strong warrior, but then sees the child has too strong a will to be manipulated. Since Terra can see the future, he can make a destiny that he designs.

Sliske will still find a satisfying use for him though.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Mon Sep 26, 2011 4:53 pm

Sliske impregnating Ruantan with basilisk venom still sounds a bit out of character.
Sliske would manipulate Ruantan to impregnate himself with basilisk venom...


Little details like that are important for Sliske's character.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Tue Sep 27, 2011 5:23 am

Sliske will have his "pets" do his work for him, but sometimes you can never send a weakling species to do a Mahjarrat's work.

His power is highly impressive, despite nearing rejuvenation stages. Command of shadows and the ability to shapeshift are amongst his talents. By manipulating the power of shadows, he can enfeeble a target, strangle them or break their bones without even touching them. However, he is a "merciful" being. He'll offer the choice to assist him in his design, but if you refuse, you will be tested. Fall and you'll may simply be discarded to serve a lesser purpose than the one he sets for you. Succeed and you live or albeit have a servitude for eternity alongside to Sliske.

Think of a voice actor and you can get the personality right. How about, Christopher Lee as Count Dooku for the voice. Here you have someone very dark.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:18 am

I'd rather give him Voldemort's voice... Tongue

Anyway, I think you're on the right track now. I'll stop nagging and debating (for now) so that you can get creative and start writing. Sorry if I've annoyed you. Smile
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:27 am

No, I want to carve a character that is correct. Your help has been very useful.

Have you seen the Clone Wars series? Do you think Mother Talzin (the leader of the Nightsisters) looks like a Mahjarrat with her markings and clothing?


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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Slayer Noir on Tue Sep 27, 2011 8:35 am

Can't say I've ever watched the series, and you spelt the name wrong, making it a nightmare to find a picture of her Tongue.

Still, I can really see your point. I can imagine that a Mahjarrat would look like her sometime between 50-150 years after rejuvination. "Mahjarrat" was the first thing I thought when I saw a picture of her.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Handeath on Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:42 am

My brother has, and I can see the resemblance. However, she's too slim, the mahjarrat have a demonic feel about the,
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:48 pm

Handeath wrote:My brother has, and I can see the resemblance. However, she's too slim, the mahjarrat have a demonic feel about the,

Within the series, whenever Mother Talzin speaks, you can hear her voice as normal, but there is also a deeper and more hollower echo in addition. It gives the feel that she is very dark and twisted.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:38 pm

You'll like this;



It was difficult to get a shot of Sliske and his "boys". To find suitable substitutes to their armour was difficult and they making sure all seven stood still long enough for a photo was just as tricky.
Karil kept needing to sit down, Verac fell asleep, Guthan was always yawning and Ahrim fancied having a little dance before the photo was taken. Sliske was the only one who was behaving correctly, until he blinked in mid-shot.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Ruy112 on Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:43 am

That's quite a nice picture actually. I suppose the red lamps cannot be removed?

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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

Post by MorbiusMonster on Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:52 am

'Fraid not, there were not alternative helmets that covered the faces like those do.
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Re: Mahjarrat Discussion (spoilers)

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