Gods one, many or fewer.

I plead ignorance on Science. Probably because that's how I was raised.

I only reject Religion because;
(a) I feel it serves no purpose, and,
(b) It does nothing for me.

Well, Religion does do something for me... but that's only if I believe in Religion in the first place. But then, the whole living for the sake of a cushy afterlife sounds selfish in itself (and a waste if the afterlife doesn't exist)... you're being good implicitly and not by choice. Well, it might be by choice - but it seems less of one. Good parenting does not require religion.

Mainly because it serves no purpose. I don't deny any cultural significance religion has had, but that purpose has been served. Religion no longer positively affects culture. I also like the theme of deities - they make for good fiction, such as games, films and books.

Hey!

PS. That isn't an argument or anything, just my two cents.

I'd go with selfish probabilistic logic. By my interpretations taking on christianity in a moral way is certainly your safest bet. There are two ways of looking at religion probabilistically both of which support this.

a) There is a high probability none of todays religions are right about god, so likely he'll just pick the moral ones therefore Christians who are moral get picked

b) The prevalence of Abrahamism, especially in the developed western countries indicates it to be the most likely. Christianity covers christianity itself, while at the same time giving you the possibility of muslim heaven and likely jewish heaven as well.

c) God don't exist, but if you picked a religion, hey it doesn't matter.

Also HI!

Also First rule of this forum. Honestly the admin wont step in unless a topic becomes like an endemic blight spreading across the forum consuming and derailing threads in the millions, then he will force you into an individual thread. otherwise, we basically talk about anyhting in our discussion threads.

That's all assuming God has the same morals as humans.

These days, some people would rather focus their lives around their families and friends, not around a single god or book.

I only have come to dislike the zealousness and judgementalism of religion, where if you aren't of conservative stock then people are considered to be damned, even if it isn't something they can't control.

But above all,religion falls into my bad books whenever its depicts wolves as creatures of the devil. It was that simple choice of words that caused almost 2000 years of unjustifiable wolf extermination.

3mpty, we should make this conversation separate from the main topic of this thread

Done, a thread of its own.

Religion is causing far too much trouble imo. But only because people abuses it, if only religion would be a personal thing and a place to seek meaning in life and create a community you feel you belong to, then fine with me.

But if you start trying to convince other people of your religion, claim that your religion is true, doing stupid stuff because of your religion (burning people, blowing up stuff, general fighting). Then religion becomes a shield, for things that it really does not have anything to do with, but then you can blame it on God, and not on yourself.

I would love to live in a world, where religion only meant something to the individual and to the people whom he chose share it with

And it was abuse of said religion which caused the beginning of the wolf cull. Prior to the supposed times of Jesus, wolves were treated with the repsect as any other animal. They were considered wise and ultimately if they ate from your herd, then it wasn't a bad thing, as it proved your herd was worth eating from.

But then, a human, that shall remain nameless, likened humanity to God's flock of sheep (which is something I'd actually like to mention...) and how the wolf was the devil, picking individuals from the flock.

All of a sudden, the wolf is now demonised as the devil's beast, yet predatory cats, coyotes, predatory birds and even domestic dogs kill sheep and aren't labled as "evil".

And another thing, why is it that we are likened to a herd of sheep? Perhaps it indicates religion's true purpose? If God is the shepherd then all he wants is a blindly submissive species that will follow at his beck and call. He'll shear us of our own body fur and sell it off to make profit and when we finally keel over, he'll serve us up for dinner or whenever he fancies something to eat.

When the sheep is eaten by the shepherd, only one is fed and the remaining meat could be wasted and it only lasts for one day. The wolf, on the other hand, feeds its entire pack on the meat, and they can keep going for days without another meal.

Odd isn't it? The wolf seeks only survival for its kind and will last for days on this one meal and may never need it again, but God's needs are simply for us to make him money and a meal for one. Yet the wolf is considered evil, because it takes something from the unquestioning flock and puts it to better use (biologically and morally).

Well, I thought about the thousand of people being killed in the name of religion through history, but heck, the poor wolf is a victim too, oh the cruelty!

Religion is dangerous in the minds of stupid people.

Re: Morb

The wolf in that fable was a metaphor, and completely unrelated to why the wolves were damned.

Foxes and wolves were both despised purely because, unlike other predators that you listed, they were simply too stupid... or proud, proud works too.

They must have identified that humans were higher on the foodchain, but refused to acknowledge our territory. Yeah, we may have took it from them, but that's how things work...

Big cats and such were never much of an issue because they kept out of our territory, birds didn't eat anything we particularly cared about and coyotes were too easy to scare... wolves and foxes just saw an easy meal and sod the consequences.

The Devil is often drawn with a similar appearance to a goat... the goat has never been victimised.

I have to point out, Morbius, that humans have every ecological right to do whatever we want. Honestly, we've outcompeted them, and no matter how much you trumpet their intellect, awesomeness whatever, we still win! And before you argue that we've used tools and technology, we made that.

Myself bein catholic I see every aspect of the world, as that I could say that I am not blinded by religion, for me its some sort of moral compass, and also all of my favourite animals are evil from the point of religion

The only reason humanity developed, was because of opposable thumbs. Had wolves developed them, they would be equally as dominant as humans.

You may claim that humans have intelligence because of technology etc., but it is because a lot of needless technology that some people are almost brain dead in terms of intellect, because a computer does the work for them. In that sense, the wolf becomes more intelligent in terms of mechanical understanding (basically the understanding of a situation by taking into account the variables and solving it to find a solution) than some humans.

Dark Avorian wrote:I have to point out, Morbius, that humans have every ecological right to do whatever we want. Honestly, we've outcompeted them, and no matter how much you trumpet their intellect, awesomeness whatever, we still win! And before you argue that we've used tools and technology, we made that.

Amen.

...at the theme of what he's saying, not at wolves/Morb in particular.

Don't worry, humans aren't smarter than that we'll screw ourselves over sooner or later. The question is whether we'll screw over wolves too in the process

This scenario has occured before. The dinosaurs all went extinct in a similar way.

Having been the predominant lifeform on the Earth at the time, evolution was not needed. When the great cataclysm occured, they were unable to adapt fast enough and died out. Other species then began to evolve to fill the void and humans occupied that place first.

Pretty much, humans may face similar destruction either at natural disaster or as a result of their dangerous curiosity and widespread and innate ignorance.

Duskcurse wrote:Myself bein catholic I see every aspect of the world, as that I could say that I am not blinded by religion, for me its some sort of moral compass, and also all of my favourite animals are evil from the point of religion

I don't see how being Catholic means you can see every aspect of the world, especially since it's wide regarded as one most "blinded by religion" religions... if that's the politest way to put it.

MorbiusMonster wrote:The only reason humanity developed, was because of opposable thumbs. Had wolves developed them, they would be equally as dominant as humans.

So? They didn't... get over it. If that's the only reason we're at the top of the food chain then so be it... stop being so unpatriotic.

MorbiusMonster wrote:You may claim that humans have intelligence because of technology etc., but it is because a lot of needless technology that some people are almost brain dead in terms of intellect, because a computer does the work for them. In that sense, the wolf becomes more intelligent in terms of mechanical understanding (basically the understanding of a situation by taking into account the variables and solving it to find a solution) than some humans.

Intelligence is subjective. Doing anything will increase your knowledge in that field, whilst decreasing/not changing in others... that includes the computer. Sitting in front of the computer doesn't make you less intelligent, it just might not further your intelligence - but only an idiot actually believes that a computer isn't a viable source of knowledge.

It's a fact of our evolution that our physical strength is depreciating as our brain capacity increases... if your refering to physical intelligence. Although, I don't think intelligence is the right word there.

Ruy112 wrote:Don't worry, humans aren't smarter than that we'll screw ourselves over sooner or later. The question is whether we'll screw over wolves too in the process

The planet's due for another reset - they happen randomly at a seemingly unrandom interval. It will probably irradiate near-all life. We probably won't live to see it, mind.

Of course, the true test of our survival would be to leave this planet (or at least expand) before the reset. That would be an achievement.

MorbiusMonster wrote:Having been the predominant lifeform on the Earth at the time, evolution was not needed. When the great cataclysm occured, they were unable to adapt fast enough and died out. Other species then began to evolve to fill the void and humans occupied that place first.

Humans hardly occupied it first... we are talking millions-billions of years. The megafauna had their time before us... big cats, terrorbirds and mammoths. We were never low on the foodchain, but we were very much primal. It wasn't until after the peak of the last ice age that we really took hold... because our competition didn't survive it.

MorbiusMonster wrote:The only reason humanity developed, was because of opposable thumbs. Had wolves developed them, they would be equally as dominant as humans.

You may claim that humans have intelligence because of technology etc., but it is because a lot of needless technology that some people are almost brain dead in terms of intellect, because a computer does the work for them. In that sense, the wolf becomes more intelligent in terms of mechanical understanding (basically the understanding of a situation by taking into account the variables and solving it to find a solution) than some humans.

Morbius, these are wolves, not your were-wolves. they are Smart for animals, but, and this is important, they are animals. You can argue that humans are animals as well, but we have the capacity for premeditation. A wolf doesn't stop before it's about to kill, think about bringing the prospective victim into slavery and approaching the victim with that intention. Don't forget, humans domesticated the wolf, not vice versa.

Also, I'm not arguing that we are INTELLIGENT because we have TECHNOLOGY! I'm saying that often people like you argue that we aren't actually that amazing because so much is done by tech and we'd be helpless without it.

We made the technology. Just because we aren't born with it embedded into us doesn't mean it isn't part of our species's evolutionary dominance. No other being this high on the food chain has ever gone to over 9000 millions. I honestly think that saying that humans are stupid because we let technology do stuff is like saying that wolves are puny and vulnerable because they let fur shield them from the elements and claws and teeth act as their weapons/tools. Well duh! If you strip a species of it's tools it will die. Just because ours aren't physically attached is no reason to say that they aren't our tools. In fact that is one of our greatest advantages, the mutability of our tools.

Amen again.

Also, what kind of God creates people like Katie Price anyway?

who is her

she

No I mean what she has done so Morb hates she like that

The great god o' Coincidence

Katie Price is effectively a bitch. They take away decent people, but leave her behind!